Sticky Post: Phillies Hot Stove

Screen Shot 2011-12-05 at 10.01.24 AM

 

3:58 PM: Another potential suitor (albeit an unlikely one) for Jimmy Rollins, the Brewers, signed Alex Gonzalez

2:14 in the PM: The Winter Meetings are pretty much over with, but we're talking with Mike Stutes about the Phillies' offseason at 2:30 over on Broad Street Radio. Give it a listen.

11:47 AM: The Phillies left the Winter Meetings without signing Jimmy Rollins: [Philly.com]

"Nothing is scheduled (with Rollins' agent Dan Lozano), but I'm sure we'll be in touch with each other sometime soon," general manager Ruben Amaro Jr. said after the Rule 5 draft brought an official close to the winter meetings. "I'm concerned about filling that spot, but overall I'm not concerned."

 

Read: I went to Stanford and play figurative poker for a living. If you don't think that I'm still sitting on a pair of Aces, you're out of your fucking mind.

Probably.

11:36 AM: Shane Victorino and Jimmy Rollins discuss Jimmy Rollins' contract:

Screen Shot 2011-12-08 at 11.36.03 AM

10:13 AM: And Pujols' agent, Dan Lozano, can buy himself A LOT of hookers with his commission. But he still has one client to worry about before going cheekbones deep in lady:

Screen Shot 2011-12-08 at 10.14.42 AM

10:08 AM: Deal is for 10 years, $250 million. No-trade clause. Wow. America will now be able to watch baseball's best player… three times a year on Sunday Night Baseball. Somewhere, a monkey claps on a giant jumbotron.

10:03 AM: Buster Olney also confirms, Pujols to Angels, per a source.

9:59 AM: Yahoo!'s Tim Brown reports that the Angels will sign Albert Pujols– 10 year, $250-$260 million. 

8:36 AM: Phillies aren't saying Rollins deal is close, but it seems most likely, according to Jon Heyman.

7:56 AM: Jayson Stark opines on the third, mystery team believed to be involved with Albert Pujols, in addition to the Cardinals and Angels. He says the following: [ESPN.com]

The identity of the reported third team remained unknown. But people within the sport suggested it was likely to be a club that has an established, big-name first baseman it would need to trade before it could complete a deal with Pujols.

Just a few days ago, it appeared that Pujols was likely to sign with either the Cardinals or Marlins this week. Now, said one source who had spoken with Pujols' camp, there is "no shot" that Pujols will make a decision before the meetings end — and, possibly, any time soon.

 

Hmm.

Let's throw some shit at the wall and speculate on an unknown source's speculation. What are some teams with "big-name" first basemen that might be able to afford Albert: Red Sox (Adrian Gonzalez), Yankees (Mark Teixeira), Tigers(?) (Miguel Cabrera), and Phillies (Ryan Howard). Those are probably the only teams that could play ball, if Stark's people know what they're talking about. Buster Olney says it's probably not the Yankees. Chew on that for a while.

Of course, trading a player with a torn Achilles would be a next to impossible task unless a desperate Midwestern team wanted to fill the void left by one of the greatest players in baseball history with a hometown kid who happens to be pretty good. But again, this is a hypothetical.

12:34 AM: Raul Ibanez, Jimmy Rollins and Ryan Madson all decline arbitration.

WEDNESDAY

11:30 PM: As if you needed to know this, Jimmy Rollins says on Twitter that he's officially declining the Phillies arbitration offer. That was entirely expected.

In an unrelated matter, now would also be a good time to point out that Philly Sports Daily's Jim McCormick predicted the drunken blackjack the Marlins are currently playing… in September.

11:23 PM: Todd Zolecki received the same text as Salisbury, apparently– he says no deal tonight with Rollins. The Phillies didn't meet with Lozano today, presumably because he was working on the biggest contract in the history of baseball for his other client, Albert Pujols.

11:08 PM: It's entirely possible Ruben Amaro is currently holed up in a hotel room with two coeds, a bottle of pino and curiously scattered feathers everywhere, all while texting Phillies beat writers conflicting reports, just to show off for the ladies. Jim Salisbury refutes Bob Brookover's report that the Phillies met with Rollins' agent tonight.

10:37 PM: Madson declines arbitration offer from Phillies, according to Jon Heyman. Goodbye, Ryan Madson.

10:28 PM: In the world of hockey, Claude Giroux just finished all over Ryan Miller. Literally. But in Dallas, Jim Salisbury expects that Scott Boras will soon announce (?) that Ryan Madson will NOT accept arbitration.

8:54 PM on the correct coast: The Inquirer's Bob Brookover, who uses Twitter surprisingly well, says Rollins' crummy agent, Dan Lozano (who is the most popular man in Dallas right now– with MLB teams and hookers), is meeting with the Phillies. Deal looks like it could get done soon.

7:11 PM: And Ruben Amaro is dripping smug all over my keyboard. When told about Rollins' agent canceling a meeting with the Brewers, Amaro said: [Philly.com]

"That's good news, I guess. I haven't heard that yet. I hope it's true."

 

That sound you hear is him smacking his wang on the table– my shortstop!

7:07 PM: A Boston reporter says that the Phillies are not sure whether Madson will accept their arbitration offer. Well no shit.

6:57 PM: A second meeting between the Brewers and Rollins' agent, Dan Lozano, was cancelled. It was at that point the Brewers knew J-Roll™ was headed back to Philly. Nothing is official, but it's another sign that the Phillies and Rollins are close.

Also, Bob Nightengale still insists that Pujols has three offers of $200 million or more, and that's with the Marlins' offer being off the table: Cardinals, likely Cubs and ???

6:29: Adam Kilgore of the Washington Post reports that the Nationals could be going after Roy Oswalt, who may be their number two option after Mark Buehrle, now that he has signed with the Marlins.

5:38 PM: It appears Jim Duquette took a momentary piss all over the Philly sports landscape– Todd Zolecki also denies his report, saying that a deal between the Phillies and Rollins isn't done. That doesn't mean it won't get done (it now sounds like it will), but it's not done yet.

5:18 PM: Jim Salisbury reports that sources on both sides deny there being a deal, yet.

5:14 PM: Jayson Stark denies report, saying there is no deal in place.

5:12 PM: MLB Network analyst Dan Duquette reports that the Phillies and Jimmy Rollins have reached an agreement. No details given. Stay tuned.

Also, a man fell in the fountain at the Winter Meetings hotel yesterday. If you haven't seen it yet, MLB has video of it here.

2:38 PM: Ken Bow Tie checks in again. He says the Phillies are still persistant on Gio Gonzalez. All jokes aside, Rosenthal hasn't slept in three days.

1:03 PM: Confliction!!! Ken Rosenthal reports a deal between the Phillies and Rollins is not imminent. Jon Heyman says it's "likely to happen." Deal would be at least three years, maybe four. Brewers still feel he's headed back to Philly. What chaos. Ladies and gentlemen, your Winter Meetings!

12:49 PM in the East: Multiple reports say the Phillies are close to re-signing Jimmy Rollins. Brewers beat reporter Tom Haudricourt (yo, vowels) is "hearing that Jimmy Rollins is staying with the Phillies," and ESPN's Chris Singleton thinks it will get done soon, too. via Hardball Talk

11:58 AM: Closer update– Huston Street went to the Padres. The Rockies are now hard (mountain joke) for Brad Lidge, a Denver area native. The Rockies are also interested in Michael Cuddyer and Cody Ross.

With Street going to San Diego, and Lidge being a target of the Rockies, the list of potential suitors may be dwindling for Ryan Madson, who could be forced to accept the Phillies’ arbitration offer. Yesterday, in our discussion on Broad Street Radio, Phillies beat writer Ryan Lawrence appropriately described the situation as musical chairs: Madson may be left standing when all the seats are filled. Good for us, bad for him.

Screen Shot 2011-12-07 at 9.49.43 AM

9:48 AM: ESPN's Jim Bowden and his molester hair report that the Phillies have discussed with the A's the possibility of trading Domonic Brown for Gio Gonzalez. No further details were given, but I truly don't understand the logic of trading a young, high-potential hitter (as skeptical as we may be) for another pitcher… unless the Phillies do, in fact, plan on trading Hamels, as was earlier reported to be a possibility by Ken Rosenthal

It's not completely crazy to think that the Phillies would trade an Ace, but said move would have to free up some dough to sign another impact player. Example: if the Phillies trade Brown for Gonzalez, then move Hamels, there would have to be another move coming… otherwise it makes no sense. Unless, of course, Ruben has completely thrown in the towel on Dom Brown, who posts stuff like this on Facebook:

Screen Shot 2011-12-07 at 10.00.16 AM
Yep.

7:33 AM: A lot happened overnight. First of all, Ken Rosenthal doesn't sleep– that should be noted. Now, here are the details:

– The third team in the Albert Pujols sweepstakes is the Angels, not the Phillies. The Marlins have offered Pujols a contract which includes provisions beyond is playing career. Here's an ESPN.com link to Jayson Stark's story, complete with a molesty-looking Jim Bowden and a tired Tim Kurkjian on an autoplay video.

– The Phillies have, however, entered the Gio Gonzalez sweepstakes, if such a thing exists. Gonzalez, the 26-year-old lefty who was 16-12 last year with a 3.12 ERA for the A's, could mean the end of Cole Hamels: [FOX Sports]

The Phillies, on the other hand, are something of a surprise in the Gonzalez sweepstakes, given the strength of their rotation and high number of prospects they have traded in recent seasons.

But the idea makes sense. The addition of Gonzalez would give the Phils the depth to trade left-hander Cole Hamels — give them or a ready-made replacement if Hamels leaves as a free agent after next season.

The potential suitors for Hamels? See the teams listed above [Tigers, Diamondbacks, Marlins and Reds].

 

It sounds like there is a third dimension to this move that is going unmentioned, or is more likely unknown.

Jon Heyman reports that Aramis Ramirez is "all but out of" the Phillies' picture, which hurts their leverage with Jimmy Rollins.

TUESDAY

9:32 PM: Just to calm you down, Jim Salisbury reports that the Phillies are not the mystery team in on Pujols. Of course, mystery teams rarely like to be identified.

In my mind, Salisbury's source is Amaro, and that conversation (via text) played out thusly:

JS: Hey Rube, Jim here– you guys third team?

RA: Fuck outta here.

JS: OK, thanks.

9:03 PM: Multiple reports have a third, dare I say mystery team in on Pujols. Said team, along with the Cardinals and Marlins, have offered Pujols a 10-year contract, but declined to be identified. No word on who it is.

Now, it would be totally unrealistic… but how fucking crazy would it be if all along when Rube was meeting with Dan Lozano, who is the agent for both Rollins and Pujols, they were talking about Albert, not J-Roll™? – manical laugh, maniacal laugh

3:45 PM: Pat Gillick, who preaches getting to know a player before acquiring him, actually met with Aramis Ramirez in the Dominican Republic last month, according to Jim Salisbury. So the Phillies' interest in him certainly isn't new.

Clearly, that meeting went well enough for the Phillies to continue their pursuit. No word on what Gillick was wearing, but I'd imagine it was either a Hawaiian shirt or something similar to what he was wearing when I saw him standing outside a Days Inn in Clearwater Beach last spring:

Screen Shot 2011-12-06 at 3.49.18 PM

3:09 PM: Inquirer beat writer Matt Gelb weighs in on the Madson-arbitration discussion, too:

Madson made $4.5 million in 2011 as one of the game's top closers. If he accepts arbitration, he would receive a sizable raise for a one-year deal. Purely guessing, but the ceiling is likely around $9 million. Maybe less.

The Phillies could then try to trade Madson to a team that is more comfortable with having him on a one-year deal or simply keep him to form the best setup-closer combo in baseball for one season.

What would be Madson's incentive to accept? He could be a free agent next winter in a market not saturated with closing options. He would still have a high visibility as the setup man on the Phillies. He'd be in a familiar environment.

 

Full story here.

2:52 PM: Stark now ruminates that, with closer openings going away, Ryan Madson may be forced into accepting arbitration (for one year) with the Phillies. That… would suck for Madson, who would presumably be relegated to setup man, and forced to test the market again next year. 

Delco Times beat writer Ryan Lawrence, who stopped by our radio show today, thought that the chances of Madson accepting arbitration could be as great as 50/50.

Great for Phillies… lousy for Mad Dog.

1:23 PM: Jayson Stark lays out the Phillies' plan, saying that they are not "shopping" Polanco, but will consider trading him if they are unable to sign Rollins. The thinking is that if Rollins goes elsewhere, the Phillies will need to replace his bat with a guy like Aramis Ramirez or Michael Cuddyer. To make room, especially for Ramirez, they would have to trade Polanco.

Problems: They're only willing to pay about a third of the $7.25 million left on Polanco's contract (God, what a shitty deal– $6.25 next year, $1 million buyout following year). Teams want the Phillies to eat more of it. Also, losing J-Roll™ and Polanco would mean a precipitous drop-off in defense– the Phillies would likely fill Rollins' spot with minor leaguer Freddy Galvis. Read the full report here.

12:48 PM: A Brewers reporter, um, reports that Brewers GM Doug Melvin also met with Lozano yesterday, but no offer was made.

12:39 PM: Ken Rosenthal takes a short respite from representing the Lollipop Guild to bring us this update– he says that the Phillies and Dan Lozano, Rollins' crummy agent, met "late into the night" last night. Which means it's entirely possible hookers were involved (I'm only half joking).

An earlier photo of Lozano, posted by Deadspin two weeks ago: [click to enlarge]

image from mobilwi.typepad.com

Jeez, he's attacking that thing with the vigor of an old lady hopping into a cold pool. Get in there, my man! If this is any indiciation of his tepid approach with Rube, J-Roll™ is going to come away with a one-year, $1.33 million deal… which would be just fine by me.

10:36 AM: Jon Heyman, who recently left SI for CBS, checks in saying that the Phillies' interest in Aramis Ramirez is "real," but it's lukewarm– they seem to be using it more for leverage with Rollins. He also throws out some other options. The "kid" is Freddy Galvis:

Screen Shot 2011-12-06 at 10.38.18 AM

9:14 AM: Morning, children. Not a lot happening overnight– it seems most of the news coming out of the Winter Meetings the last 12 hours centers around Albert Pujols, and rightfully so. Some AM reading on the Phils: video of Amaro speaking with CSN, Bob Brookover spins something out of nothing and writes about Aramis Ramirez and Freddy Galvis filling Rollins' role, Brewers looking at J-Roll™George Sherrill? and assistant GM Scott Proefrock on why the Phillies didn't go after Reyes.

Also, reader "Nike Shox shoes" (real name?) checks in down in the comments. He says: "I'm sure it's not me, but doesn't Kyle mention a penis in every post? The daily update is called Morning Wood for god's sake."

I don't know what you're talking about, ya dick.

MONDAY

10:31 PM: Jayson Stark reports that the Phillies and Jimmy Rollins' agent may meet again tonight.

7:43 PM: Scrath that last one– CSN's Jim Salisbury says that the Phillies and Camp Ramirez have nothing scheduled tonight.

7:04 PM: After a brief break for dinner and a frustrating distraction with the new Sixers mascot selections, we're back and ready to go. Looks like Matt Gelb of the Inquirer is kicking a little ass this evening. He reports that Ruben Amaro has "dug in," or, as I like to say, "whipped it out." 

Ladies and gentlemen, your GM via Gelb:

"Honestly, there is no rush to do anything [with Rollins]"… And on his meeting with Rollins' agent, Dan Lozano: "It was a meeting."

Ohh smug. This isn't going to end well for Rollins, Lozano or his hookers. In fact, Amaro plans to meet with the agent for Aramis Ramirez tonight. Ramirez is either a Plan B for the Phillies or a pile of chips in Amaro's poker game. We shall see.

4:35 PM in the East: Happy hour must have started way early in Dallas. Very few updates in the last few hours. It's entirely possible that a drunken Ruben Amaro is trying to pawn off a useless Placido Polanco. That or he's waterboarding Rollins' agent.

Many more (real) updates after the jump. This is a sticky post– newer posts are below.

3:42 PM: Ruben Amaro just sexted Jimmy Rollins a picture of his wang: Does this look like it belongs to someone who will blink first?

3:29 PM

Screen Shot 2011-12-05 at 3.29.31 PM

Either that or the Big Poker is just trying to put the fear of God in Jimmy Rollins: I'll do it, I'll fucking do it, Jimmy. I sign Aramis and you're done here. Your move. Want to blink now?

3:04 PM in the East: "I gave the Phillies a discount the first time." – Jimmy Rollins

That quote, via a source of the Inquirer's Matt Gelb, who has more here. Gelb, like Salisbury, says that Rollins remains firm on his five-year demand, and the Aramis Ramirez rumors arose out of the "epic Roman battle" between Lozano and Amaro. It looks like Rube is ready to play hardball… Lozano may want to take cover… or call one of his hookers.

2:42 PM: Well, this isn’t surprising. Jim Salisbury gets his reporting on– he says that the meeting between Amaro and Lozano (Rollins’ agent) “did not go that well." Hmm… perhaps it did play out like that whole “epic Roman battle” thing from earlier. 

Sources tell Sully that J-Roll™ is still – ludicrously – asking for five years, a request that has led to the below Aramis Ramirez rumors. One source tells Salisbury those rumors are all smoke and mirrors, and merely serve as a bargaining chip with Rollins… another tells him that the Phillies are melodramatically coming to terms with the fact that J-Roll™ may not be a Phillie next year. Stay tuned.

2:15 PM: Hey, let's pile on Polly! It's like Hop on Pop, only with bad elbows, aching backs and huge heads, or whatever. Buster Olney dials in to the Twitter machine to bring you this update:

Phillies said to be very down on polanco because of injuries, lack of pop.

 

Ouch. True– but ouch. Can't say I disagree, however… The thinking is that they may be able to move Polly to acquire Aramis Ramirez.

1:04 PM: Nats reliever Tyler Clippard wishes his friend well. Cute.

Screen Shot 2011-12-05 at 1.04.07 PM

12:58 PM: Ken Rosenthal is on his game today. He reports that one "rival exec" says the Phillies are actively shopping Placido Polanco and his many ailments so they can sign Aramis Ramirez.

12:22 PM: Ken Rosenthal checks in from bow-tie land– the Phillies deal with Nix is apparently worth $2.5 million and should not preclude Ruben from slapping is dick on other bargaining tables, thankfully.

Also, one rival agent tells Rosenthal that there is an "epic Roman battle" between the Big Poker and Rollins. I'd imagine J-Roll's™ crummy agent, Dan Lozano, is the one supplying some hooker with the war helmet… but what do I know? If the Phillies can't come to terms with Rollins, their next option is… minor leaguer Freddy Galvis. I just gulped

11:46 AM: Agents feel that it's more and more likely that Michael Cuddyer stays in Minnesota. No surprise– especially as it relates to the Phillies. Thome, Wigginton and Nix don't leave much room for the 32-year-old right fielder.

10:36 AM: Joe Capozzi of the Palm Beach Post tweets that the Phillies are "strong players" for Aramis Ramirez…

10:09 AM: Rollins Tweeted with our friends over at (@SportsTalkPhila). He actually gave a little bit of insight. Says there's no timetable. 

Read backwards:

Screen Shot 2011-12-05 at 10.08.49 AM

10:03 AM: Buster Olney spoke with perpetual liar Ruben Amaro– he said that the Phillies have not had any contract extension talks with Cole Hamels, but he has spoken with Jimmy Rollins' crummy agent, Dan Lozano. Rollins appears to be top priority for the Phillies.

9:15 AM: Jon Heyman says the Phillies haven't ruled out going after Michael Cuddyer, another slow, plodding white guy.

 

Share on facebook
Facebook
Share on twitter
Twitter
Share on linkedin
LinkedIn
Share on email
Email

129 Comments

  • Reginald Denny December 5, 2011 at 10:18 am

    Hey Kyle, 60% of MLB is white. Just an FYI.

    Reply
  • MM December 5, 2011 at 10:23 am

    David Wright must really want out of new york now, put some feelers out poker.

    Reply
  • FACE December 5, 2011 at 10:37 am

    I can honestly say that for the third off-season in a row, I have no i-fucking-dea what RAJ is thinking or plotting on.
    It just better be good.

    Reply
  • yaya December 5, 2011 at 10:47 am

    i hope its aramis.

    Reply
  • Blonders December 5, 2011 at 10:47 am

    Hopefully they can fit Aramis and Jimmy into the budget. I guess they would then trade Polly and his $6.5 million to make room?

    Reply
  • OneManWolfpack December 5, 2011 at 10:48 am

    I don’t get all the white guy stuff?! Who cares? I agree with FACE though… I hope this is all part of a bigger picture. Rube is a confusing man.

    Reply
  • FACE December 5, 2011 at 11:09 am

    I’m down with Aramis Ramirez. Get that shit done RUBE!

    Reply
  • jeff December 5, 2011 at 11:19 am

    Aramis will turn 34 this year is likely looking to make one last big FA payday. Not so sure it’s wise to put a lot of money into another mid-30’s player…

    Reply
  • Andrew December 5, 2011 at 11:23 am

    I agree with Jeff. Haven’t we been down this road before??? Aramis is not going to take a deal less than 3 years, not to mention the type of $ it will cost.

    Reply
  • Kyle is Becoming Angelo December 5, 2011 at 11:23 am

    Jeff, please be sure to include race/nationality when referring to any over 30 MLB players. Thank you.

    Reply
  • FACE December 5, 2011 at 11:27 am

    …meh…well what would it take to get Wright from the Mets’ then?
    It’s a fire sale up there can they get em’ on the cheap? Fuck, send em’ that Canadian Aumont kid.

    Reply
  • J.T. December 5, 2011 at 11:38 am

    Doesn’t matter what RAJ does this year. The fucking Marlins are going to win the World Series.

    Reply
  • yaya December 5, 2011 at 11:51 am

    the marlins aren’t going to win the world series. they have two of the worst personalities in sports as the corner of their franchise.

    Reply
  • Craig December 5, 2011 at 12:01 pm

    I agree with Jeff, I just dont like the idea of adding another aging bat for an insane price. Ramirez def also hasn’t been that great over the years.

    Reply
  • Kenny Junod December 5, 2011 at 12:22 pm

    let that punk j roll walk

    Reply
  • Todd December 5, 2011 at 12:32 pm

    @J.T. Just wait til the Marlins hire Juan Castillo as their hitting coach.

    Reply
  • teamtobeat December 5, 2011 at 12:34 pm

    how is Rollins a punk?

    Reply
  • Dominic December 5, 2011 at 12:34 pm

    I would like to get both Aramis Ramirez, and Rollins… couldn’t hurt. I would not mind trading Ty Wigginton off to another team for prospects.

    Reply
  • JohnnyRockets27 December 5, 2011 at 12:53 pm

    Rollins is a fuck. hes still got his glove but his bat is completely gone. i say let him walk. this teams not winning a world series as long as chase and howard are in the lineup anyway. so let galvis come up give him his shot and sign another ss this offseason. just to be safe assuming galvis sucks (which is likely)

    Reply
  • Gary December 5, 2011 at 12:57 pm

    “slapping is dick”
    Way to nail those punchlines slugger

    Reply
  • fresh December 5, 2011 at 1:03 pm

    Aramis Ramirez rumors are heating up

    Reply
  • MM December 5, 2011 at 1:30 pm

    Ramirez only K’d 69 times in 565 AB’s, nice…

    Reply
  • SJ Iggle Fan December 5, 2011 at 1:34 pm

    I can’t wait to see the Marlins blow up with 2 punks (Ramirez and Reyes) on the field and a lunatic (Guillen) in the dugout. It could be a nuclear holocaust

    Reply
  • Blonders December 5, 2011 at 1:37 pm

    Maybe Rube and Montgomery are prepared to say fuck the luxury tax and sign A-Ram and J-Roll. If not we won’t miss a beat defensively with the kid Galvis and anything he contributes in the 8 hole is a plus.

    Reply
  • SJ Iggle Fan December 5, 2011 at 1:38 pm

    AR might be 33, but he has hit over 25 HR 7 of the last 8 years. The RBIs have been down a little but a little of that is because none of the other Cubs can hit worth a shit except for big Z

    Reply
  • fresh December 5, 2011 at 2:20 pm

    Thanks Buster, tweets like that will really help our cause!

    Reply
  • Rams December 5, 2011 at 2:21 pm

    AR also plays at wrigley field. I could hit 25 hr’s there, he’s to old,, thought the object was to get younger

    Reply
  • FACE December 5, 2011 at 2:48 pm

    @ 2:42pm- FUCK!

    Reply
  • Wings December 5, 2011 at 3:00 pm

    J Roll sucks

    Reply
  • The Eyeroller December 5, 2011 at 3:19 pm

    jimmy absolutely gave the team a discount last time that allowed the phils to sign utley and howard longterm as well as clear some cash for the pickups that have made this run possible. he deserves to be rewarded for that.
    he is also the heart of this team and has been for a decade. and taking care of jimmy will show cole that the phils do reward their homegrown talent and possibly lead to easier negotiations with him.
    but five years is a little ridiculous. i am all for giving him a PILE of cash (back a truck up), but maybe just three years with an option, you know?
    but the freddy galvis era does not sound to me like a world series run would be in the near future…

    Reply
  • FACE December 5, 2011 at 3:30 pm

    Galvis isn’t ready. The best SS on the market not named Jimmy Rollins is Rafael Furcal.
    I’d say they’re pretty screwed if they don’t sign him.
    @ The Eyeroller- I agree. 5 years is a bit much. I’d even go 4 with a mutual 5th option. They have to sign him though.
    Rube’s nuts are hanging out in this negotiation. He has no leverage and he’s dealing with a complete scumbag in Lozano. The Aramis Ramirez talk just gave him less leverage if anything. I bet Lozano laughed his ass off at that.

    Reply
  • Blonders December 5, 2011 at 3:35 pm

    Rube is hangin’ dong all over the Winter Meetings! I love it!

    Reply
  • mac December 5, 2011 at 3:49 pm

    the last three years J-roll has been paid accordingly based on his production.
    8.5 million is about right for what he has done in 2009, 2010, and 2011. He speed has diminished dramatically. His plate discipline sucks, and always has. Ive seen him swing at the first god damn pitch all the time only to hit a shallow pop up. He has stolen fewer bases, BUT has increasingly been caught stealing more. From 2001 to 2007, he played an average of around 156 games a season. Since 2007 he has made trip(S) to the DL in every season, missing an average of 25 games. He has NEVER been a decent lead-off hitter. You used to be able to expect him to hit at least .280… now we might as well accept .240 with his aging skills.
    The reality is that Jimmy was in his prime from 2004 to 2007. During those four years he excelled and had many accomplishments. That doesn’t mean the phillies have to pay patronage to him because of stats he put up 5 years ago. If Jimmy “took a discount for us one time already” then thats his own damn fault. Jimmy Rollins has not established himself enough to deserve a 5 year contract worth around 75 million. The players on this team who have received these large contracts (Halladay, Lee, Howard, Utley) are players who at the time were able to display they were capable of playing at the high caliber that the money warranted. Jimmy Rollins has not shown that he is able to put up the stats that his desired contract warrants.

    Reply
  • Utleys Son December 5, 2011 at 4:02 pm

    When are we going to give more money to Hamels?

    Reply
  • Mike M. December 5, 2011 at 4:31 pm

    At this point, let J-Roll go and sign Ramirez. Try to trade Polanco to a team in need of a second baseman (which is his more natural position) for a “defense first” shortstop and maybe a situational lefthanded reliever. If you can’t do that then let Galvis mature at the plate in the big leagues… because everyone agrees that he can already field the sh*t out of the ball.
    Seriously… imagine this line-up: Victorino-CF, Utley-2B, Pence-RF, Howard-1B, Ramirez-3B, Mayberry/Nix – LF, Chooch-C, Galvis-SS, Pitcher’s Spot. They’d still win 100 games.

    Reply
  • Schtick Coma December 5, 2011 at 4:42 pm

    I’m sure it’s not me, but doesn’t Kyle mention a penis in every post. The daily update is called Morning Wood for god’s sake. Please, no more mentions of Roman helmets and sexting and dicks slapping against things.

    Reply
  • Jar's Gut December 5, 2011 at 6:25 pm

    Let j roll’s lazy ass walk & change the culture of the clubhouse

    Reply
  • Token Black Guy that hates Kyle December 5, 2011 at 7:37 pm

    no doubt, Jay Roll got a few free hookers from his agent.

    Reply
  • Nike Shox shoes December 5, 2011 at 7:45 pm

    I’m sure it’s not me, but doesn’t Kyle mention a penis in every post. The daily update is called Morning Wood for god’s sake. Please, no more mentions of Roman helmets and sexting and dicks slapping against things.

    Reply
  • yaya December 5, 2011 at 9:48 pm

    ^it’s just you. which is kinda wierd. so you should probably reevaluate your life and the people/influences in it

    Reply
  • Token Black Guy that hates Kyle December 5, 2011 at 9:52 pm

    sounds like Nike Shox shoes has dick on his mind

    Reply
  • Joe December 5, 2011 at 10:16 pm

    question, why does Aramis have to be Plan B, why couldn’t they both be brought in? Ramirez plays 3rd base, if we trade Polanco and his salary away, and we still need a SS pretty sure Ramirez can’t play that…

    Reply
  • Ted Mosby December 5, 2011 at 10:22 pm

    The Philadelphia Phillies should resign Jimmy Rollins

    Reply
  • erectiemiddel December 6, 2011 at 5:35 am

    Kenneth H. Rosenthal is an American sportswriter and reporter and was involved in a controversial segment of ESPN’s Outside the Lines..Nice information..

    Reply
  • Phil from Mt. Airy December 6, 2011 at 7:50 am

    The old wh*te guys on the phils have to hate J Roll playing DJ in the lockerroom

    Reply
  • I Hang Dong December 6, 2011 at 8:30 am

    They need to make a trade for a younger SS like Stephen Drew & get a nice bat for 3B or LF. They also need to gauge if they’ll be able to sign Cole – if they know it’s a long-shot they could do a sign-and-trade & land a young Superstar like Carlos Gonzalez (also would have to include a guy like Dom Brown). Can’t keep committing all this money to over 30 guys or you’ll be sacrificing re-signing guys like Cole & eventually Pence.

    Reply
  • I Hang Dong December 6, 2011 at 9:34 am

    And I know I’ll catch a lot of crap suggesting Cole might leave, but he could fetch 8yrs 200 mil on the open market next year. They need to figure out what to do with him. You cant let him walk for nothing and if you wait & let him test the market you’ll have to match an insane offer at that point to keep him

    Reply
  • that guy December 6, 2011 at 9:50 am

    It’s not gay to talk about penises (penii?) so often, because Kyle went to Malvern.

    Reply
  • Schtick Coma December 6, 2011 at 10:21 am

    I made the original comment, which was copied by someone else, as some constructive criticism. I did provide three examples from this post. You don’t have to be Umberto Eco to make this point (I’m surprised someone else hasn’t). I take it as a crutch (most people would rather be homophobic).

    Reply
  • Rob December 6, 2011 at 10:53 am

    Why don’t the Phils try for switch-hitting Emilio Bonifacio? The Marlins won’t be needing him anymore, and he’s cheap, young, and can get on base. Fast too.

    Reply
  • Blonders December 6, 2011 at 10:56 am

    If they sign Vizquel it will be official……they will be TRYING to get older.

    Reply
  • yaya December 6, 2011 at 10:57 am

    it’s been nice that iron balls mcginty hasn’t made a stupid attempt at humor

    Reply
  • Todd December 6, 2011 at 11:03 am

    @Blonders …or that Rollins is too expensive and they’re trying to give Galvis more time to develop.

    Reply
  • Iron Balls McGinty December 6, 2011 at 11:04 am

    shut up yaya… shut the f up

    Reply
  • Capt. James Tiberious Kirk December 6, 2011 at 11:18 am

    KKKKKKKAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Reply
  • Caucasian Interlocutor December 6, 2011 at 12:13 pm

    Point of clarification please: Is it or is it not alright to approve of white people (currently)?

    Reply
  • Joe December 6, 2011 at 2:44 pm

    I don’t see how if we bring Rollins back and keep Polanco its going to help this team at all, we haven’t (as of yet) got better at all as a team. And I don’t see it happening at all if they are only willing to bring in Ramirez if we miss out on Rollins.

    Reply
  • Beez Nutz December 6, 2011 at 3:37 pm

    as i told you all before
    R.A.J is a bum
    Love
    Beez Nutz

    Reply
  • ThePhillyFlash December 6, 2011 at 7:03 pm

    Well, Aramis won’t remind anyone of Brooks Robinson with the glove, but his bat would be more than welcome in Philly.

    Reply
  • Hot Dog Special December 6, 2011 at 8:53 pm

    Ruben spoke about changing the lineup after the phillies were exposed for the 3rd straight year. Start with Rollins. Have him take his punk swagger and get the f out of town. He can jog out ground balls elsewhere.

    Reply
  • The NBA Sucks December 6, 2011 at 9:33 pm

    If the Phillies are the mystery team for
    Pujols….Rube’s got the BIGGEST set ever.

    Reply
  • Steve December 6, 2011 at 9:50 pm

    Ramirez and Galvis can’t do much worse at the plate than Rollins and Polanco did last year. Polanco was down right brutal after he got hurt.
    Getting Madson back through arbitration and having him be the setup for one more season would be an A+ move.

    Reply
  • AAAAAAAAAAHHHHHH December 6, 2011 at 10:01 pm

    FUCK YOU FOR GETTING MY HOPES UP EVEN A LITTLE BIT THAT THE PHILLIES ARE THE MYSTERY TEAM FOR PUJOLS. FUCK. YOU.

    Reply
  • yaya December 6, 2011 at 10:21 pm

    no really iron balls. you are really funny

    Reply
  • The Ultimate Deli December 7, 2011 at 7:59 am

    J Roll & his lazy Bobby Abreu approach gots to goooo. I head from a few players that his clubhouse music he plays is terrible toooo

    Reply
  • Matt from Morton December 7, 2011 at 8:07 am

    What’s this nonsense about trading Cole Hamels? Unless they think they can parlay that into Gio, David Wright, and prospects… ? Regardless… this seems like madness.

    Reply
  • Wheels December 7, 2011 at 8:29 am

    Better not trade home grown cole. I’ll go nuts

    Reply
  • Pat December 7, 2011 at 8:36 am

    Cole hammels is game on. Not gonna be happy if he gets traded.

    Reply
  • Stubby Flick December 7, 2011 at 8:38 am

    Reading the part about the possibility of trading Cole Hamels makes my blood boil. If that were to happen, I would to have to seriously question the direction and leadership of this organization, which I have strongly supported over the better part of 10 years.
    Trade Cole Hamels, come on. What sense does that make?

    Reply
  • Joey Banner December 7, 2011 at 8:56 am

    trading hammels would be an eagles organization type of move

    Reply
  • FACE December 7, 2011 at 8:59 am

    You can’t trade Hamels. You just can’t do it. That makes absolutely no sense.
    I really hope all of the winter meeting rumors are just that, RUMORS, because there’s been nothing good coming out of them for the Phills.

    Reply
  • FACE December 7, 2011 at 9:02 am

    …and at this point with Rollins, fuck it. 3 years 4th year option and if he doesn’t like it, start talking to Florida about Hanley Ramirez. He doesn’t want to play third. I’m DOWN!

    Reply
  • CarrotLeague December 7, 2011 at 9:20 am

    The only way I can swallow a POSSIBLE Hamels trade is if Hamels/Polanco go to Texas for Michael Young and possibly David Murphy (the ballplayer)

    Reply
  • Blonders December 7, 2011 at 9:37 am

    Dom, Worley and May for Gio. Then if they really want to trade Hamels send him to TOR for Lawrie, D’Arnaud, Gillies, and/or Drabek? I can see RAJ hanging dong on this because idk how they can afford 3 pitchers making $20+mil and that albatross of a contract Howard as well. Then re-sign Oswalt? It would be a Paul Holmgren-esque makover.

    Reply
  • Todd December 7, 2011 at 9:47 am

    I’m just waiting for RAJ to shock the baseball world again by swooping out of nowhere for a huge name.

    Reply
  • Rams December 7, 2011 at 9:54 am

    I want no part of a hamels tradE. Just pay the man, lock him up. Now onto Gio, yeah would love him to be our fourth horse. Id give up dom, Worely, and stutes.

    Reply
  • Beez Nutz December 7, 2011 at 9:55 am

    @Todd
    as a reminder since youre not listening
    RAJ is a fuckin turd .. dont get your hopes up
    Love,
    Beez Nutz

    Reply
  • FACE December 7, 2011 at 9:56 am

    It pains me to say this because he is our steed, but I’d rather them trade Cliff Lee then Hamels. Hamels is younger and still has the potential to get better.

    Reply
  • Rams December 7, 2011 at 10:06 am

    Or dom for Gio

    Reply
  • Andy (San Diego) December 7, 2011 at 10:11 am

    I think the Phils are going to try to make a play for David Wright.
    And I’m a big Hamels fan, but do you really want to pay Cliff Lee money for a guy who still hasn’t even come close to winning 20 games? I don’t think so.
    Trading Dom Brown for Gio? Yikes! So he couldn’t be traded for Halladay, but now he could be traded for Gio Gonzalez? That doesn’t speak well of Brown at all. He’s turning into Marlon Byrd II.
    And I think Pujols will sign in Anaheim.

    Reply
  • Joey Banner December 7, 2011 at 10:11 am

    Dom Brown is creepy

    Reply
  • Matt from Morton December 7, 2011 at 10:17 am

    Why all the man-love for Michael Young? He’s old (and white, in keeping with the themes here)… If I’m trading Hamels, I better have a young stud 3B and some prospects when the wheelin’s done (ahem, David Wright?). Michael Young and David Murphy ain’t worth it.
    Really, if I’m RAJ, I’m not trading Hamels, end of story.

    Reply
  • fcskills December 7, 2011 at 10:34 am

    Uhm, how about they are in on Gio because they have ZERO intention on re-upping on Oswalt AND Dom brown’s value in this organization has completely tanked. Sorry, but Gio for Brown is a STEAL for the Phillies. And as much as Kyle seems to keep wanting it to happen, Cole Hamels is going nowhere. 4 players actually did their job vs. Cards in playoffs: Doc, Maddawg, BennyFresh, and… COLE. The steed choked the big one.

    Reply
  • Bill December 7, 2011 at 10:42 am

    Cole Hamels is likely to get a contract that rivals Lee and Sabathia….not likely that we re-sign him.

    Reply
  • bigmyc December 7, 2011 at 10:56 am

    Well, I’ll start by saying that you run a nice, comprehensive blog…but sometimes, as is the case here, I think you tend to over think a wee bit. I don’t believe that they intend to trade Hollywood at all. Sending Brown out for Gonzalez only means that they don’t think too highly of a kid who is rapidly getting a reputation for being a slight concrete head. Hey, they have 2 aces who are approaching mid 30’s and need ANOTHER young piece of the rotation…you know, to ADD to what Cole brings. Now, this could be wishful thinking on my part, but I don’t think this is the case. Dom Brown doesn’t exactly seem like the brightest bulb in the candelabra these days.

    Reply
  • Pete H December 7, 2011 at 11:04 am

    Trading cole is such a stupid idea, no matter how much anyone tries to rationalize it. Hes our youngest ace, has the experience, and gets the job done. A big part of our game last year was Hamels going up against the 3rd and 4th pitchers in other teams rotation…You just wanna trade that away? And if our pitching staff couldn’t get it done last year, how is getting rid of one of its corner stones taking a step forward?

    Reply
  • Adam December 7, 2011 at 11:09 am

    If hamels has made it clear to management that he wants to test the market, then u could argue for trading him. If CJ fucking Wilson is a “prized free agent” then cole will more than likely get cliff lee money. Gio is under control for 3 more seasons. But I would like to see D-Brown play some more. But unless cole gets an extension from the team he will be traded to, then only a contender would want a rent a player. And no way RAJ trades cole train to an NL contender. So most likely an AL contender. Which would most likely be Texas, Detroit, Boston, yanks and maybe 2 other wildcards…

    Reply
  • peteh20 December 7, 2011 at 3:22 pm

    One of my teachers knows Ryan Howard and he said that the fo doesn’t tell them much. He hasn’t heard much from j-roll and didn’t seem to think the Aramis theory had legs. What he did say he heard was talks the phils were most interested in upgrading 3rd with a trade for David Wright or Evan Longoria i’d imagine we trade dom brown and aumont and some low-level (class a) talent. I’d be fine to show jroll out if we can put in longo and stick galvis in the 8 hole

    Reply
  • yaya December 7, 2011 at 4:48 pm

    damn now im gonna hope the phillies get longo. even though thats never gonna happen

    Reply
  • peteh20 December 7, 2011 at 5:44 pm

    well we supposedly just resigned jroll. don’t know the terms yet. I kinda hope it’s not long, I wanted to see what we got in Galvis.

    Reply
  • peteh20 December 7, 2011 at 5:48 pm

    this same thing happened with madson before they turned around and signed pap.. It’s impossible to tell with this team

    Reply
  • I hate holding in my farts December 7, 2011 at 6:18 pm

    J roll is so lazy

    Reply
  • AAAAAAAAAAHHHHHH December 7, 2011 at 7:02 pm

    Is there a second mystery team for pujols? I heard the marlins were out but there are still 3 teams with over $200 mil. offers.

    Reply
  • peteh20 December 7, 2011 at 7:07 pm

    prob cubs cards and angels

    Reply
  • Von Hayes December 7, 2011 at 7:55 pm

    Phils are the mystery team & Fat Albert will play 3rd.

    Reply
  • A Concerned American Citizen December 7, 2011 at 8:38 pm

    Von Hayes is still an idiot an a troll…FAIL

    Reply
  • Dwayne December 7, 2011 at 8:41 pm

    come ruben learn from the eagles and bring jimmy home already… you see what happened when they let b dawk go…

    Reply
  • Todd December 7, 2011 at 9:07 pm

    Jimmy Rollins is nowhere near the likes of Brian Dawkins. Dawkins put his heart and soul out there on the field…Jimmy doesn’t even run out ground balls.

    Reply
  • ThePhillyFlash December 7, 2011 at 9:13 pm

    Well, as long as the Fish are out of the running for Pujols. That’s all I care about. So, will they chase Prince Fielder now?
    Meanwhile, Jagr just scored, putting the Flyers up 4-3 on Buffalo after digging a first period there goal hole.

    Reply
  • Pete the Crab December 7, 2011 at 9:28 pm

    B Dawkins gives 110% every play; J Roll is a indisciplined lazy fuck

    Reply
  • peteh20 December 7, 2011 at 9:44 pm

    consider the talent at shortstop in the league. It’s pretty low right now. We take it for granted to have at the very least a well above average shortstop every year. I don’t really wanna see what happens with someone like wilson valdez (whom i like as a utility guy) there all year

    Reply
  • Dwayne December 7, 2011 at 9:56 pm

    Dawkins was the heart and soul of those eagles teams and rollins is the heart and soul of the phillies. who else leads that squad????

    Reply
  • Captain Jack December 7, 2011 at 10:41 pm

    I can’t wait to watch J Roll jog to first base after hitting ground balls. Lazy fuck.

    Reply
  • Shannon December 8, 2011 at 12:09 am

    You guys are such morons.
    Jimmy Rollins runs the defense and is an incredibly smart baseball player. There’s a reason both Charlie Manuel and Larry Bowa love him.

    Reply
  • Ryan December 8, 2011 at 2:28 am

    Runs the defense? What is he, a fucking linebacker?
    Back to the kitchen.

    Reply
  • yaya December 8, 2011 at 2:48 am

    for real doe. there isn’t a better option at short stop right now. big mistake not to bring him back

    Reply
  • CarrotLeague December 8, 2011 at 8:24 am

    Good morning, Crossing Broad…CLBT pondered the idea of Pujols coming to Philly based upon exactly what actually happened with Howard in the 2011 NLDS (minus the prediciiton of him popping an achilles): http://www.carrotleaguebaseballtoday.com/2011/02/welcome-back-baseball-in-2011-albert.html (scroll about halfway down). How about a little Twitter love?? Thanks for your updates! Great stuff!

    Reply
  • matt December 8, 2011 at 8:46 am

    3rd team in Pujols talks is the Eagles. Andy wants to him to coach the defense next year.

    Reply
  • Shannon December 8, 2011 at 8:51 am

    @Ryan: You don’t watch much baseball, do you?
    When Eric Bruntlett had his unassisted triple play, it was Jimmy Rollins who was shouting instructions at him …
    J-Roll directs traffic all of the time on infield plays.
    And when the Phils are hitting, he calls balks on opposing pitchers oftentimes before the umpires see them.
    He’s a very smart baseball player.
    And the people calling him lazy are racist assholes.

    Reply
  • Blonders December 8, 2011 at 9:14 am

    If reports of a mystery team are somehow true about that team having a big time first baseman, then it’s definitely the Phils. If the Yankees are out, why would the BoSox trade Gonzalez, who has a way more team friendly contract than 10yr-220mil. The Tigers wouldn’t trade a younger version of Albert (minus the defense). I am pre-ing in my pants with the possibility of this. The contract would either be around the same annually as Howard’s if not less. 10 years is a long time but he is a machine, remember?

    Reply
  • Bri December 8, 2011 at 9:29 am

    Shannon,
    If Jimmy was such a smart baseball player he wouldn’t be benched by the manager for not running out ground balls or constantly try to hit for power in the leadoff spot causing Charlie to put him in the 6 or 7 hole at times. The problem is he the lack of quality shortstops in the league. While he is great defensively, you do not lead a defense in baseball, its not football with different formations. I highly doubt Utley or Polanco need or have the time during the play to listen to Jimmy’s instructions, and how often do you see balks and triple plays in baseball?

    Reply
  • Mystery Team December 8, 2011 at 9:33 am

    Somebody take Howard’s contract

    Reply
  • Dan Theman December 8, 2011 at 9:55 am

    The only way to trade Howard is to throw in an incentive. Young talent. That means a top pitching prospect or Dom Brown. Would St. Louis do that with the size of Howard’s contract and his achilles injury? I don’t see why not.

    Reply
  • Anthony December 8, 2011 at 10:00 am

    There is a similar blog dedicated to the phillies, not as funny as here though, that posted a good outline on which teams could be the other possible mystery teams. Of course, the Phillies are the leading contender.

    Reply
  • 20 wings December 8, 2011 at 11:05 am

    i just hope j roll stays away from the hookers

    Reply
  • Todd December 8, 2011 at 12:00 pm

    @Shannon So, when I see Chase Utley running his ass off on ground balls and almost beating some out, then look at Jimmy jogging on ones he could CLEARLY beat out…what do you call that then? Apparently not lazy, wouldn’t want to be racist!

    Reply
  • "Big Poker" Rubin Amaro Junior December 8, 2011 at 1:18 pm

    Everyone chill the fuck out, I got this.
    FACE

    Reply
  • Luke December 8, 2011 at 1:38 pm

    More like he is sitting on 3 and a half aces. Get it? GET IT? Because of the pitching rot—–ehhh you get it.

    Reply
  • Ken Junod December 8, 2011 at 1:45 pm

    @Shannon- how is calling someone lazy r@cist?????? Get your head out of your a$$.

    Reply
  • CarrotLeague December 8, 2011 at 2:03 pm

    So, I guess we’ll never know who the mystery team was. Angels had better not think about using the term, “dream team”

    Reply
  • Ryan December 8, 2011 at 6:07 pm

    Shannon, I don’t think YOU watch much baseball. All shortstops are supposed to do that, and most do, not that it actually helps. You also managed to cite some of the rarest plays in baseball in the balk and triple play. Why am I not surprised you’d play the race card to help bolster your poor argument? He IS lazy and it has nothing to do with his race.

    Reply
  • Spindot December 8, 2011 at 6:13 pm

    To compare B-Dawk to Jimmy Rollins is disgusting. They do not even belong in the same sentence.

    Reply
  • Sandy Whelen December 8, 2011 at 7:10 pm

    J Roll is so lazy & it has zero to do with skin color. Shannon get some facts & come back & see me

    Reply
  • ugg boots on sale December 8, 2011 at 8:50 pm

    this same thing happened with madson before they turned around and signed pap.. It’s impossible to tell with this team

    Reply
  • Ugg Boots Clearance December 10, 2011 at 1:15 am

    as the Fish are out of the running for Pujols. That’s all I care about. So, will they chase Prince Fielder now?
    Meanwhile, Jagr just

    Reply
  • Justin Bieber Shoes December 12, 2011 at 10:45 pm

    She finally got in to see her Wonder Therapist (not Cindy, but Cindy has hired someone else with the same training), and now she’s doing pretty fine — or at least much better than before. So, she says, hopefully she will get back to the sweater, but it turns out she is quite a bit more busy with work than she thought she would be for December. It’s all good. More work for her means more toys and treats for me, plus it makes her happy.

    Reply
  • DodiiVK April 1, 2013 at 7:19 am

    Добро пожаловать на новый сайт аля epidem здесь можно скачать программы и игры. Все с файлобменников совершенно бесплатно. Качайте сегодня [url=http://everop.ru/]Все для фотошопа[/url]

    Reply
  • kubo June 1, 2013 at 1:12 pm

    Ottimo articolo su di un argomento interessante ed importante che andrebbe ulteriormente sviscerato.

    Reply
  • Burberry Silk Scarf February 20, 2014 at 7:06 am

    still couldn’t get them spotless. The same criticism applies

    Reply
  • Leave a Reply

    Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *