JVR Shot Dead, Traded for Luke Schenn

Screen Shot 2012-06-23 at 6.37.50 PMAnd yes, Luke Schenn does look like Liam Neeson

In case you’ve been under a rock for the last little while (like I was…), the Flyers have traded James van Riemsdyk to Toronto for Luke Schenn. 

Schenn is, obviously, the brother of Brayden. He is a 6-2, 220 lb defenseman, which is exactly what the Flyers need. But, despite JVR playing sans balls at times, the straight-up trade is a bit surprising. Schenn didn't have a great season either, and you can argue that JVR is the better player. Just a year ago (literally, one year ago today), he, along with Claude Giroux, was being cited as the main reason why the Flyers were comfortable parting ways with Mike Richards and Jeff Carter. Now, he too is gone.

Screen Shot 2012-06-23 at 6.37.11 PM

The positives are that Schenn’s cap hit ($3.6 million) is less than JVR’s ($4.25 million) and his contract has four years remaining, as opposed to JVR's six, which is a long time for a player that, thus far, has underperformed.

Wherever you stand on this trade (or the Richards one… or the Carter one), you had to admit that the trend of the Flyers locking up players to long-term deals (which, ostensibly, makes them harder to move) and then trading them soon after – less than a year for both Carter and JVR – is concerning. What exactly does it say about a team’s talent evaluation if they keep throwing millions at young players only to get rid of them before the ink on their contract has time to dry? Or, are the Flyers just really overreactive?

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60 Responses

  1. lol at citing upshall and lupul as young offensive talent…lupul is a dime a dozen 20-25 goal scorer who is horrendous at every other aspect of the game
    upshall is straight up garbage
    more fashion show reporting and less sports analysis would do this site well

  2. So to come to this site, you either have to put it on your favorites bar or take the time to type it in your URL bar.
    Seems like a lot of effort for a person who doesn’t like the blog. Since you’re obviously a genius “ghost of leonard tose,” I’m sure you’ll understand my suggestion: find another blog to read.

  3. i don’t think it’s preposterous to assume maybe he is a fan of the site and dislikes the direction it’s been heading?

  4. JVR was a key piece in a proposed deal for Rick Nash, so you can prob say that deal is dead in the water, but would take a Parise or Ryan to supplement the offensive drop off even though there isn’t a large one after the season Reemer had.

  5. I don’t think “more fashion show reporting and less sports analysis” was an actual suggestion. Call me crazy, but if I don’t like something I’m reading on a website, I read another website.
    I’m not your boss or your mother though. Do whatever you want.

  6. your question about talent evaluation is a good one… the move seems a bit reactionary to me. but i happen to fall on the side of those who think that JVR was given opportunity to perform and he proved a bit inconsistent for homer (yes i know he was injured a lot – still that counts). i think everyone agrees he has tremendous upside, whether that is ever realized is another question. tough call. i wouldnt take homer’s job in a million years. hope schenn performs at a high level. and jvr too for his sake. what a classy guy he is

  7. The Flyers were too quick to reward JVR with that big extension after one good playoff stretch. If his 2013 is anything like his 2012 then Toronto is going to be stuck with that contract as no team will take JVR off their hands. Kyle, it’s like the old sayings goes – “You can only wait so long for a guys balls to drop before you have to go in and rip them out…and mail them to Canada?”…wait…what?

  8. Every commenter on this site is a butthurt Flyers fanboy. You guys must cry yourselves to sleep every night because the Flyers haven’t won since ’75. Somehow you find a way to blame Kyle for it. Kyle puts up a post about the Eagles or Phillies and it gets 5 comments, but god forbid, he puts up a post about a Flyers trade or Jeff Carter going balls deep in random trim and you guys lose your shit. Always here in full force to troll these boards like no other fans in the city. You Eddie Snider disciples need to chill out. To be clear, I am a huge fan of every philly sports team and am not always a fan of Kyle’s blogging/writing.

  9. JVR is hurt and has been battling injuries off and on…and your surprised that Schenn is all we got?
    My god your dumb…We traded damaged goods with a potential to be good for a guy that has the same potential possibility (no injuries) and plays defense.
    The long term deals were made because they thought these players would live up to it and they haven’t.

  10. JVR sucked. he was the 2nd pick in draft and is dog shit compared to the 1st pick (patrick kane). Im glad we got a good defensemen. have fun jvr. u bum

  11. remember when we scored like 70948549 goals in the playoffs but were still bitching about losing. and bitching about a shitty defense. Well we just traded a 3rd line offensive piece for a solid 2nd line D man. Great move. We don’t need JVinjuRy

  12. This trade is an NBA contract swap. Both players were high draft picks, with decent sized salaries, who under performed.
    JVR has potential, but he was hurt a lot of this season and has been streaky over his career.
    I also wonder is the FO is getting annoyed by his passive behavior at times. Him staying in college and not moving to the pros was a point of contention. Now there is the surgery that has been on the books and off the books at least twice.
    Hopefully Schenn does a better job with the job of scenery than JVR.

  13. Hahaha, the ‘shot dead’ hyperbole (hoping it’s more than a little bit of that) is an amusing bookend to the Richards-and-Carter-killed-by-Homer meme.
    JVR had his chances. Unfortunately he spent way too much time injured to make his cap-hit tolerable. If he was wrecking shop like ha did a couple post-seasons ago, well, can we really say this would have happened? Overpaid for under-performing and riding pine is no way to go through a career. I think, like many other former Flyers who got the boot early on in their careers and went on to mature elsewhere, JVR will find his stride, eventually. Obviously with the Flyers having issues on the blue-line they needed some kind of defensive acquisition, and pairing brothers up seems to be back in NHL-vogue for the last few seasons.
    Not every player can flourish on every team; there is no reason to expect JVR and Schenn will both have extremely awesome first-seasons or extremely terrible first-seasons with their new teams.
    The fact that former Flyers who started their careers with Philadelphia tend to do well after leaving the organization is not some indictment of their inability to see talent. If anything, that fact says the Flyers organization has an outstanding scouting system, and they can see talent where most other teams do not.
    I think it is folly to confuse the business of getting returns on investments with some ill-informed ideal whereby teams should stick with their investments through thick and thin over the long haul for the sake of some kind of chivalrous honor. When a player falls short of expectations, repeatedly, why does it make sense to retain their services? The NHL is all about “what have you done for me lately.”
    This trade looks good for both teams.

  14. Dear STFU, I’m not a Ed Snider disciple, i dont like the business side of anything. i.e Joe Banner.
    Felt good to see Simon Gagne hoist the Cup, and I respect Marty Brodeur. I love the game. period.
    If Snider could get Mitt Romney to drop the puck next opening home game, he’d do it. Power corrupts. ask Tim Thomas.

  15. For being “the third sport” and all you really make your stubborn points try and stick out with the flyers.
    I usually like this blog, but you have been really mediocre with the flyers dude.

  16. Patrick Sharp aside, who have the Flyers traded away that played better after leaving?
    Leave off any current King, because I’d argue that they played exactly the same, just on a team better positioned to win.

  17. A fanboyish defense of the blog looks just as stupid as complaining about it. Don’t like what the comment says? Don’t read them. Right?

  18. @B – Justin Williams? Dennis Seidenberg? Patrick Sharp? Four cups between them since leaving Philadelphia. Dainus Zubrus? (LOL at this one, but he gets props for hanging around and staying competitive for so long)

  19. Wasn’t defending the blog at all, just making a point about how gay you all sound (you know who you are). Also, genius, how am I suppose to know what the comment says if I don’y read it? Everyone stop with that argument, it makes no sense.

  20. For the people who still compare JVR to Patrick Kane:
    What did you expect the Flyers to do? They had the worst record in the league, lost the lottery to Chicago and took the best prospect available instead: JVR. He didn’t work out. It happens. There are tons of top draft picks that just don’t work out sometimes. Stop comparing JVR to Patrick Kane. It’s an unfair comparison.
    Anyway, B is right. Richards and Carter filled in nicely in LA, but the Flyers would not have won the Cup had they still been here this past season.
    The absolute ripping of the Flyers makes no sense to me. The Eagles haven’t won in over half a century: they get a pass. The Sixers are a little better, but still haven’t won since 1983, and have been mostly mediocre since then with the exception of one or two years: they get a pass. The Phillies were the first professional franchise to lose 10,000 games, were God-awful throughout the late 80’s and the entire 90’s (except 1993) and have only recently had success: and while fans show them some frustration, they too get a pass. Does any of that make sense? The Flyers on the other hand won two Championships before the Phillies won one, and with the exception of a handful of seasons, have been consistently competitive and have made the playoffs almost every year. Yes, we can’t give them a pass because of that, but at least they are there every year, and always go balls to the wall to try and win a championship. Sometimes, it doesn’t work out. Sometimes you run into a dynasty (New Jersey, Detroit, Edmonton, Islanders, Canadiens). Why does it seem like the other teams in this city get a pass, but the Flyers constantly get ripped?

  21. Most of these Flyers related comments on here equate to something like this: “OMFG HOW DARE YOU CRITICIZE THE FLYERS ORGANIZATION. THEY’RE FUCKING PERFECT, THEY MAKE NO MISTAKES, AND THEY’VE WON 3 CUPS IN THE 10 YE…” …oh, wait, they haven’t won shit since ’75. Keep up the good work, Eddie.

  22. I’m a die hard fan of every major team in the city. I have Eagles season tickets and go to games of all four teams often. I reside in camden county, nj. I also hate the pens with all of my heart.

  23. I’m just tired of the contigent of Flyers fans who can’t accept the idea that maybe, just maybe, the Flyers organization isn’t perfect. Every other team in this city takes it on the chin hard from their own never-say-die fans when they screw up. You’re the biggest group of sensitive pussies I have probably ever seen.

  24. Okay genius, since you seem to have a grip on the game of hockey, what would you have liked the Flyers to have done differently all these years? As much as Kyle will have you believe, Mike Richards and Jeff Carter being on the team this year would not have brought the Cup. Everyone bitched and moaned for a goaltender, and they went and got one. As “die hard fan” you should know how difficult it is to play in this city for some athletes. Bryz had trouble adjusting, but he is a very good goaltender, much better than Leighton, Boucher, Biron, and all the other crap we have put up with for all those years. Also as a “die hard fan” you must learn to have patience. I know you have it since you have Eagles season tickets, and they’re the most frustrating team in the city. The Flyers have one of the top 3 players in the world (Giroux) and a bunch of young talent that is only going to get better. Please tell me how you would have done things differently. As a HUGE hockey fan, I know that the Flyers are set up to be an elite team for many years to come. Again, as a “die hard fan” you should know that the best team doesn’t always win (Phillies last year, Eagles in the early 00’s, etc.) but the Flyers will ALWAYS be in the conversation to win it all. I really don’t know what more you could ask for.

  25. ave no idea how to run a hockey team and neither do you. But not once in your rant did you mention any of flaws in the Flyers and they way the run their team. The “in the conversation every year” way is exactly how you fall short every year. It’s why the Eagles haven’t gotten over the top. The bigger priority of “staying in the conversation” or staying relevant every year is more important the risking it all and going for it. All in the name of keeping the cash cow flowing. I understand it’s a business, but my point is that Eddie Snider’s first priority is bringing you a cup. Lurie’s isn’t a superbowl. The first priority is your money. Atleast Eagles fans can see it, and they put the pressure on the organization, even we still buy the tickets. Your just naive and in denial, and X Live Eddie has you wrapnped around his finger.

  26. are you really cool with the average second round exit every year? The Flyers have ALWAYS been “in the conversation” for the better part of 40 years with no cups in between.

  27. You’re free to go with this last thought: You know what the conversation is about “Flyer”? It’s about how the Flyers haven’t won one in 37 years.

  28. Okay I’ll ask again since reading seems to be difficult for you. WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE DONE DIFFERENTLY? Should the Flyers just tank every year to get the top pick and hope for the best? I’d rather have a shot every year than not. You’re only argument is that they haven’t won in 40 years. Awesome, tell me something I don’t know. They went to the Stanley Cup Finals in 2010 and if the guy they traded to Columbus (Jeff Carter) knew how to lift the puck, there would have been a Game 7 and maybe the Flyers win that game. The Eagles haven’t won since the 60’s, but I’m still a huge fan of theirs. The Phillies have been around almost as long as baseball itself, yet they have the same amount of championships as the Flyers. I don’t really care about basketball, but I’ll always root for the Sixers, and even they have the same amount of championships as the Flyers and they have been around FOREVER. Average second round exit? Same as every other fucking team in this city, but the Flyers fans are pussies because we always support our team and contrary to what you might think, Homer made good fucking trades. If you could give me anything other than “They always lose in the second round” I can tell you’re one of the fans that turns them on during the playoffs and doesn’t watch them all year. We have a good team that will turn into a great team soon, just watch.

  29. Bryz sucks. They traded two of their best defensive minded forwards (Carter/Richards) and non of the other forwards with the exception of Couturier/Talbot have a clue about how to defend in their own zone. The Flyers are very flawed… get some bigger/defensive forwards.

  30. Carter & Richards were party boys. Sucessfull teams have LEADERSHIP. For all you “Bryz Sucks” experts, a goalies job is to stop the first shot. if a defense is weak, its a shooting gallery all game.
    STFU is one of those “die hard fans” who think the bottom line wins games. Money is a motivator, true…but its the players personalities and how well they all fit together.
    Brian Westbrook said it best: ‘These young guys aren’t motivated; they’re the Xbox generation”

  31. @Carl – when was Carter ever a defensive (two-way) forward? He is a lazy player and I’ve never seen him back check.
    @STFU obviously has no idea about hockey.
    I’m happy Carts and Richie are gone. Not to mention JVR. Flyers management have kept the team young and competitive.

  32. Richards and Carter were after thoughts on the Kings, not the leaders they were here. That was Dustin Brown, Kopitar, and Quick’s team.
    Everyone really thinks the Flyers would have been better with Giroux on the ice 8 minuets less a game, and not having Tailbot, Bryz, or Jagr…not to add Voracek, Simmonds, Coots, Schenn, Grossman. (with Rich/Carts contracts, no money to spend in FA).

  33. LOL @ Carl for calling Carter a defensive minded forward. Mr. High and Wide himself was as lazy as they come. Jeff Carter is 6’4″ and 200 lbs. and he never EVER used that size to his advantage, just like JvR. They were/are power forwards who play like small finesse players. Also, Bryz sucks clearly shows you never watch the team. Yes he has a huge contract and yes, he definitely did not play up to it. But if you would rather have Boucher, Leighton, Emery, etc., then you have no idea what you’re talking about. Bryz, and the whole team for that matter, has a year under their belt. Homer improved the defense that now boasts Timonen, Coburn, Grossmann, Schenn, Mezaros, and Carle (who is most likely going to resign). If he can add another forward to replace JvR and most likely Jagr, I have no doubt in my mind this team will be a Stanley Cup favorite. That’s the beauty of it, Bryz doesn’t have to be perfect next year, he just has to make the saves he is supposed to make. The offense will only get better and the defense is now one of the best in the Eastern Conference. I’m telling you, hop on the bandwagon now, I smell a dynasty.

  34. LOL you guys are pathetic. “what would you have done differently” and “you obviously have no idea about hockey” are the only thing you’re kind has to say when faced with critizism of the Flyers. Give me a fucking a break.

  35. “well atleast we don’t have Leighton anymore or Emery”
    “well we didn’t do this, or we didn’t do that atleast!”
    “we have no fucking cups since forever, but atleast we’ve been close!”
    You can’t bring yourself to utter even a word of contructive critisizm for this team. And anytime someone else opines about the state of the team, it better be a perfect fucking picture that is painted, or you just lose your shit. Again, give me a fucking break.

  36. And in case you haven’t noticed, I haven’t critisized the Flyers directly. I’ve taken a few jabs, but they deserve it. I never critisized the Richie/Carter trade either, as you pointed out unprovoked. My beef from the beggining of this discussion was with you, and the other fans who think like you.

  37. Okay, we’ll try this one last time. From what I can gather, your only argument is they haven’t won in 40 years, which is something a retarded 5 year old could tell me. That leads me to believe that while you may call yourself a fan, you really don’t have a clue what you’re talking about in terms of what the team should and shouldn’t do. Contrary to what you may think, I don’t care if the Flyers are criticized or not. My argument is that I think Kyle is DEAD WRONG about the trades being bad ones. Your beef is with the way I think? That’s absolutely fine, but I’m trying to see what you would have done to make the team better, because I truly believe the moves Homer has made are great ones and the team is set up to be elite for the next decade. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE I am begging you to give me something, anything, other than “I disagree with the way you think”.

  38. Totally agree w/ Flyer. You guys pick apart the Flyers, just make like your username & stfu, & watch the games during the season, & stop complaining.
    Would you rather be a Columbus Blue Jackets fan every year?
    Yeah the Flyers haven’t won the Cup in 37 years, no fucking shit, do you really think we don’t know that?
    Chicago didn’t win it for like 50 years until they beat us. At least we have a chance every year. We pretty much win games every year & yet you people complain. Go bitch about the Sixers.

  39. This is soooo stupid. Die hard here and I’m sick of all the stupid arguing with absolutely ZERO points. Both shut up. I like how Shut The Fuck Up is the one complaining (about anything) and talking/fighting the most. And you know you can post all your thoughts at once in one post right? Cool.
    Anyway, to those who don’t look at stats, yeah Carter was a good defensive player. He wasn’t physical but it doesn’t mean he’s bad defensively. Like Kimmo or Carle or Lidstrom. He played well positionally and with good stick work.
    He consistently was put out against tough competition, with mediocre to good teammates, and in the defensive zone about 45% of the time and pushed play forward and created chances and points for. He lowered chances and points against and all against the opposing teams best players.

  40. Keep justifying it any way you can guys. I’m not talking about any specific trade(i.e. richards and carter), I’m talking about the same act over and over again from the same ownership. Btw, the Flyers aren’t an elite team. Elite teams wins championships.

  41. There’s obviously a better way to do it Flyer, as some of our biggest rivals have won multiple cups since our last. I don’t have the answers, I’m not a hockey gm. You want me to go back through 37 years and nitpick through each move? That’s ridiculous. If you’re mad about what i’m saying then you’re Flyers apologist in my opinion. None of our other teams get a pass like the Flyers do in this town. Why? because of the “hardcore” flyers fans that live to tell you why the Flyers are such a great team every year.

  42. one more for captj and sportsfan: THANK GOD I’M NOT A BLUE JACKETS FAN! what a loser mentality.

  43. Multiple championships? The Devils won 3 Cups because they played the most boring style of hockey imaginable, the trap and because they happened to draft the greatest goalie of all time. The Penguins won twice in the 90’s because they had two of the greatest players of all time in Lemieux and Jagr and one in 2009 because they were god awful for how many years in order to get Crosby, Malkin, Staal, Fleury, etc. The Rangers have only won 4 times and they’re a fucking Original 6 team. You’re bitching about the same formula over and over again and I’m saying that’s not true. They went out and got a goalie by trading two good, young players who were signed to EXTRAORDINARILY LONG contracts. Do you think Richards or Carter will be productive when they are 34, 35, or 36 years old? My gut is telling me no, and we now actually have cap room for once. Your only argument is they haven’t won and my only argument is that Homer has set this team to contend for a Cup for the next decade. What else could you want?

  44. Lol true Shut up.
    And yo, Brodeur is NOT the greatest goalie ever. He is FAR FAR FAR from it! Yeah, not close. Brodeur is a fraud (dot com)

  45. STFU – There *is* a better way to do it. And that’s with a coach who can actually fucking coach. The Devils won because if nothing else they’ve had good to excellent coaches, even when they couldn’t keep them for more than a year or two.
    It’s NOT THE PLAYERS, DUMBASS. IT’S THE FUCKING COACH.
    Tell me Richards and Carter would have been the key to breaking the Devils forecheck and beating their modified 1-3-1 trap so I can fucking laugh at you. Please, do.

  46. Most wins and shutouts? Yeah he is the greatest goalie of all time, don’t let the bias cloud your judgement

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