Mike Sielski Has Once Again Taken Aim at The Orange and The Black

Voila_Capture103Our favorite new columnist hell-bent on destroying the Flyers’ culture and the old guard, Mike Sielski, has penned his latest grammatical murdering of the OB over the Steve Downie trade.

Go ahead, Mike:

Though he has matured from his first stint with the Flyers, Downie still piles up penalty minutes at a faster rate than most players. He has 36 already this season. So in the midst of a 3-8 start, the Flyers and general manager Paul Holmgren have decided that the best way to right themselves is to promote former tough guy Craig Berube to head coach and trade for a tough guy in Downie. So much for a fresh, clean start. So much for a culture change.

No, the primary problem here is the Flyers’ belief that a marginal move like this was worth making in the first place, that a player who brings an “edge” was what they were missing most. It’s not.

While Sielski does acknowledge the most positive aspect of the deal for the Flyers – that Downie is a free agent after this season, giving the OB some flexibility – he uses the rest of his words to destroy the team and point out the fact that they make it almost too easy to ridicule them.

I don’t disagree with any of that, but Sielski is being a bit unfair here. Sure, Steve Downie is exactly the sort of player the Flyers would trade for, and they shouldn’t be given the benefit of any doubt. However, this is a relatively minor move that accomplishes two things: adds a touch more skill and gives them a bit more salary cap flexibility (Talbot had two years left on his deal). I liked Talbot– he’s a very good two-way forward and, as I wrote the other day, he’s a hockey player, but he, too, is the sort of player the Flyers value too much over guys with speed and skill. Downie is a little bit better. Though Sielski discredits that claim by noting that Downie had his most success playing with Steven Stamkos and Martin St. Louis.

Flyers reporter and commentator Ryan Bright takes issue with that:

Anyway, Sielski is right– it’s laughable that the Flyers added another grit, tough guy with upside to play for a coach known for his grit and toughness and for a team known, unfortunately, for their grit and toughness. But, it’s hard to get upset over adding more skill and flexibility. What you should be worried about is what Paul Holmgren will do with that flexibility. It’s the same thing that worries me with Ruben Amaro. Do you really trust either guy to make the right decision and not keep chasing their tails to another poorly-constructed squad? I don’t.

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38 Responses

  1. Really don’t understand why everyone is getting their panties in a bunch over such a minor trade. Forget skill set, the fact Downie comes off the books after this year made the swap worth it. Why the hell would we need Talbot for another 2 years?

  2. Ryan Bright’s point is nonsensical. It’s not that the Flyers could have received Datsyuk, but the Flyers thought it was worth it to being in Downie.

  3. This dude Sielski shows up on the scene, learns the hard way what we all have known for a long time, that Ed Snider is a narrow-sighted prick in his old age, and he is now severely butt hurt. Perhaps permanently butt hurt.

    Every time I see an article where he rips the Flyers, right or wrong, I immediately think he is ripping them simply because he got yelled at by Eddie.

    1. not really a bright comment, Vince. Sielski stood up to Snider before being snipped at, so it’s not like he has some agenda. He just saw what many of us have been seeing for since the early 90s. and finally, someone in the media had either the balls or the brains to point it out.

      That said, Sielski does have to be careful. We all know his point. If he continues to constantly hammer at the team, itll become annoying and obviously self-serving (since he knows he’ll get a response)

      1. I am not saying he doesn’t have a point or that he is wrong. But when you get chastised by the team’s owner on television and then fire off 3 articles purely criticizing the team, it seems like he is just out for revenge. I actually agree with alot of what he says, but it just comes off as him crying.

        1. I agree that lately hes coming across as desperate and crying a bit. my point was just that I dont think its because he’s out for revenge. If anything, Snider should be out for revenge. Sielski fired the first shot, so he’s clearly criticizing them not because of when Snider shot back at him. just my opinion

          1. Yeah, all I am saying is that the perception by readers, right or wrong, may be that he is a scorned lover or something. Again, I agree with him on most of his points, although not about the Downie trade.

  4. Oh my FUCKING God. Downie is not a “tough guy.” He’s not the same Steve Downie that was here the first time and as I commented on an article on here yesterday, I bet 98% of people saying it was a dumb trade haven’t seen Downie actually play in years.

    And if anyone says “uhh well Talbot was a PKer” shut the fuck up. So you’re telling me you’d rather have a guy, whose main attribute was killing penalties, over a guy that can actually produce points, play physical, etc?

    I get that Talbot was a fan favorite here. I liked him. But if you say that this trade was stupid or not in favor of the Flyers, than you’re an absolute idiot.

    Type OB fans are the ones crying over the trade, not making a case for it.

  5. I like Sielski. His argument, this time, may be a bit petty but for the first time in a long time someone is challenging Snider & Co.’s way of thinking. It’s a breathe of fresh air amongst the noxious brain farts that Panotch and the rest of the dick-nuzzling beat writers provide readers. Plus he’s a La Salle guy. Hard not to like that.

    1. Mr. Grace,

      Allow me to educate you once again and refute your childish remark about Mr. Talbot. I have it on good authority that the reason Mr. Talbot was traded was directly a result of the incident that occurred during last week’s game. As I educated this forum last week, Mr. Talbot questioned Snider after being injured. Specifically, Mr. Talbot stated that he was not going to return to the game after experiencing a laceration to his face and a brain injury. Snider threatened to send Mr. Talbot to the minor league club if he did not return. Mr. Talbot also informed Mr. Berube that he was unable to play. Despite this, Mr. Berube forced Mr. Talbot to continue to play and advised him to “take it up with management.” Mr. Talbot has been distraught at the mistreatment that he received at the hands of the game’s biggest bully, Snider. Mr. Talbot has not fully recovered from his brain injury and has requested additional time to heal. Rather than allow Mr. Talbot to heal, Snider did what he does best. He traded the player for another one of his goons. Members of this forum, we need to stand up and not allow Snider to continue to bully his players and endanger their lives. I believe that it is time to hold a protest. How does Thursday the 7th sound?

      Thank you

      Edward Murphy

      1. Mr. Murph, that’s fuck up Evil Eddie Snider would do that. Hate to say this but kind of think this world & nhl would be better off if Eddie would depart.

  6. I don’t get why this trade gets this dude so amped up. He acts like the Flyers activily sought out Downie. What prob happened was they wanted to unload talbots expensive contract (bc who wants to pay a 4th liner a 1.7m cap hit) and in the process got a versatile forward who can play all 4 lines and 3 roles – he can be an offensive compliment to talented players, a gritty hard worker antagonizer, or a goon if need be. He gives 110% every shift and supplies energy… Which is what the Flyers lack. Not a bad move. If you take Downie’s name away and just look at his stats and how fans from Colorado view him, everyone would love this trade. Certainly not the player he was his first go around with the O&B.

  7. The “same old Flyers” comment is probably pointing at the circus that is the revolving door the Flyers have for old players and their constant obsession with goons to uphold the “bullies” image.

    Guess what! Times have changed. You need to play strong gritty hockey but also put the puck in the net. Hockey isn’t all about laying the big hit nor fighting everyone on the ice anymore. So many other teams make progressive strides to make their teams faster and more skillful to keep up with the current game. Its the reason why teams like Edmonton are going to be a powerhouse once their young players mature and they get a hold of a decent goalie.

    You’ve already got Rinaldo and Rosehill now you add another goon in Steve Downie. Not to mention we’ve been tortured with Jody Shelley and Dan Carcillo over recent years as well. Max Talbot was banished to that 4th line but he was the only bright spot about that line. We’ll just continue to watch skilled opposing players skate circles around our team and pay no mind to the cement heads lumbering around the ice trying to throw and ill-timed (and out of position) check while they blow right passed them. There’s just no room in the line up for THREE of these guys in today’s NHL.

    1. Steve Downie is not a goon like he used to be. Have you seen him play since he left Philly the first time? PLEASE tell me how Downie is more of a “same old Flyer” than Talbot was. You say “other teams make progressive strides to make their teams faster and more skillful.” Are you trying to say Talbot has more skill and speed than Downie? That would be a pretty dumb assessment, if it’s the case.

      Edmonton is so much further away from a “powerhouse” than you think. Have you not heard that they’re shopping their 1st round (1st overall) pick from last year?

      1. More of a same old Flyer in the fact that he throws bad hits, “contributes” by piling up unnecessary penalty minutes instead of playing hockey, and has a bad reputation with the league and officials. Another Rinaldo. Talbot is a hard worker, knows his role, and does his job. You’d rarely see him in the box for something unwarranted. And I’m not saying Talbot has offensive skill nor did we sacrifice offensive skill by trading him. Downie is just another one of these guys that we are gonna be pained to watch him mainstreamed on the top line to squeeze any production out of the guy that we can. You barely see many other teams doing this. The top line should be feared for his scoring ability – 2/3 of a top line is a liability.

        And I’m not saying Edmonton is going to win the cup next year I’m simply stating they are building that team properly for the new era NHL.

  8. I like what Sielski has been doing, and I don’t disagree with his overall point. But this quote gets to me:

    “So much for a fresh, clean start. So much for a culture change.”

    The fuck were you expecting, Mike? Snider told you (YOU! directly!) that they weren’t changing the culture, that they didn’t need to. And now you’re surprised that they didn’t change it?

    I’m not saying the team doesn’t need the culture change, but to blast them as if they said they were going to and are now not backing that up is disingenuous.

  9. I love, love, love that a writer is openly challenging the Flyers. I really do. However, there is a fine line that a writer like Sielski can cross into unfairness or, worse, douchey self-promotion. I hope Sielski doesn’t cross that line.

    This article is somewhat unfair inasmuch as this trade was a minor one and was probably a move to address the cap as much as anything, which is a good thing. To treat this move as a major personal decision (despite the optics of bringing in a former Flyer tough guy) is a bit unfair.

  10. Once again Sielski works into his piece and rips the choice of Berube because of how he played. Can someone please remind him that guys like Darryl Sutter and Lindy Ruff racked up the PIMs in their playing days and have turned out to be pretty damn good coaches. If he wants to critique Berube, then do it for his coaching, not for his reputation from his playing days. It’s ridiculous! As far as the trade goes, so you DON’T make this move just because the guy is an ex-Flyer? He’s a dope.

      1. Mr. James,

        Please enlighten me on what exactly my schitick (spelled incorrectly) is? Since when has being concerned for another human being’s wellbeing been a bad thing? I am concerned with how my children and their children grow up. I want to be able to take my son to a game and not be worried that he is going to see a player die on the ice or field or what have you. I want my son to be able to join an organization and not have to be worried about a member of the coaching staff being a child predator. Time and time again, I have presented concrete evidence proving that Snider is not concerned with the wellbeing of his employees and will do anything in his power to make an extra dollar. Are you one of those immature members of our youth community that cheer when a player’s livelihood is turned upside down via a hellacious life threatening injury? I do know that you have not extensively studied the equipment provided to the Philadelphia Flyers players like my organization has. I do know that you are childish and uneducated to how the real world operates. It is because of individuals like yourself and other youth of our society that I have not used this forum in some time. I have come back because I know that Mr. Scott is just as concerned as I am and has provided an excellent venue filled with thousands of concerned citizens to put a stop to sports’ biggest bully as well as other sadists in our community. I will be praying for you Mr. James.

        Thank you

        Edward Murphy

        1. Mr. Murphy,

          Please enlighten me on your findings. Where or what is your evidence? What is your organization? You’ve been making these claims for some time yet I’ve never heard the Flyers organization being investigated for providing inferior equipment to its players. Nor have I ever heard the NHLPA make any claims that the Flyers force players to play when it is not in the players best interest physically or mentally. No, I do not root for players to get injured nor do I cheer when players are hurt during competition. But as someone who has played physical sports for most of my life I can tell you that injuries do happen. I would most likely assume that the Flyers use the standard/required equipment that the league regulates.

          1. Mr. James,

            Please elaborate on the specifics of your request. There are hundreds of thousands of documents at our disposal that we would be delighted to share with you. Countless times in the past, we have provided specific evidence whenever we have exposed Snider, Lurie or any other person who we have stood up against.

            Allow me to briefly address some of your questions and concerns. My organization is a volunteer program that stands up and fights against those that bring down our society. My organization has been very involved with the NHL and NFL’s concussion awareness programs and were heavily involved in the decision to change the icing rule to eliminate some of the dangerous plays from the game. I cannot begin to tell you how many times we have exchanged proposals with the league. We have financed many studies to come up with safer equipment. As a result, many players now wear socks and shirts underneath their padding that helps prevent them from being sliced open from a sharp blade or stick. As you specifically stated, you would assume that the Philadelphia Flyers would provide their players with standard equipment. I can assure you, that is not the case. Having said that, I once thought the same. That was until I was educated on the specifics of how they operate their club. Are you aware that Snider was the biggest voice against the Icing rule change? He was also against the new rule preventing players from removing their protective helmets while engaged in fighting. Snider is an advocate for violence. The primary reason that the Philadelphia Flyers have not been punished publicly for providing inferior equipment is due to Snider’s power in the game. The man is a bully.

            I am well aware that injuries happen in the game. I do not like it, but some things we cannot prevent. What I cannot allow is when injuries happen as a direct result of being provided with cheap, plastic, inferior equipment while their peers are provided with the proper protection. What I cannot allow is when injuries happen as a direct result of a player being forced to play with an injury.

            I can tell that you are deeply concerned with the direction of the game and the safety of the players. I would like to take this opportunity to invite you to our next rally, tentatively on Thursday November 7, 2013. I will personally educate you further on the matters at hand.

            Have a great weekend.

            Thank you,

            Edward Murphy

  11. It is the RAJ dilemma: I love this trade for cap reasons, but, God forbid Downie goes on to score 20 goals – I don’t trust Homer not to ink him to a new 5 yr deal.

  12. To all the morons, especially Sielski, saying Downie “still piles up penalty minutes at a faster rate than most players….”
    He has a lot of PIM now, but most are fights, which doesn’t put your team shirt handed. He only has 3 minor penalties in 11 games.
    And 27 of his 36 PIM came in two games. He’s not the goon he once was.
    Get your facts straight and come back and see me.

  13. ever since this dweeb’s blow up at eddie, every blog and shitty flyers caller on the radio drops the word culture and thinks it’s making a point. just saying the word culture means nothing. give examples. next caller that does it should be forced to endure a BJ from wooden teeth Rhea

  14. Fact #1: Except for ONE season in which he scored 22 goals, a nice season but not a great season, this clown has never scored more than TWELVE!
    Fact #2: He will rack up triple-digit penalty minutes.
    Fact #3: His reputation alone will lead to penalty calls against him and the Flyers (see: Carcillo, Rinaldo, etc.)
    Fact #4: Lindy Ruff and Darryl Sutter were decent players and tough guys. Craig Berube was a goon.
    They dumped Downie once, he’s not worth bringing back. Stop the revolving door! Make a deal that will actually make this team BETTER! What a novel concept…

  15. To the asshole that goes by the name “straight facts:”
    How does this move make them worse? You’re a fucking stat nerd, so look at Talbot’s. His ain’t good either. This trade doesn’t hurt them now and helps them later with cap space. Let’s face it. The flyers have some bad long term contracts (Hartnell Simmonds) and they need to clear up done space somehow.
    Talbot blows and Downie is slightly better.
    Straight facts is a dumb fuck.
    That’s all.

  16. Hey pussy Eddie Murphy, where is your stupid fucking rally? I want to come so I can kick your fucking ass you stupid no good pussy.
    Bring some “documents” and I’ll rip them up and shove it all down your throat. Possibly even shove my cock in your throat you no good pussy.
    You’re a real liar on here. You never exposed me with shit. My players are safe.

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